Category: 2019

Yerevan / 11.02.19 / Turan: More and more Armenian citizens are inclined to believe that the future of the country is linked to Western values with Europe. Just the rapprochement with Western civilization that most of all corresponds to the economic, political and cultural needs of Armenia. The co-chairman of the European Party of Armenia, film director Tigran Khzmalyan said this in an interview with Turan.

What then is the reason that a significant part of the citizens of Armenia consider it necessary to focus on Russia, and not on the West? Khzmalyan answered that according to the latest polls in Armenia, 87% of respondents were in favor of deepening ties and relations with the European Union. "Therefore, one should be careful in stating that the majority of Armenians are in favor of an alliance with Russia. I personally think that Armenia is not just under Russian influence, but under Russian occupation since November 29, 1921," he said.

The European Party of Armenia proceeds from the fact that Armenia remains an occupied territory, with limited sovereignty and the main task of the political elite and the whole society in restoring national sovereignty, Khzmalyan said.

When asked how Armenia"s relations with Russia should be built, he said, "We are not allies and partners of Putin"s Russia. This country once again departs from the European vector of development. We see how this country self-isolates from the world and pulls along behind those countries and peoples that are in political and economic dependence on it. Moreover, Russia is pursuing an open colonization policy.

It is enough to say that practically the entire economy of Armenia, its energy sector, the financial and banking sector, the railway, aviation, communications, communications, as well as the security system and much more, are under the complete control of Russia. Under these conditions, it is absurd to talk about sovereignty," Khzmalyan says.

During the four months of its existence, the European Party of Armenia brings this position to the public of the country, as well as to the Russian Embassy. "We are categorically against the stay in Armenia of the Russian military base and the forces of the Federal Security Service of the Russian Federation," our interlocutor notes.

Let us assume that the Armenian government will raise the issue of withdrawing the Russian base from Gyumri, and revising relations with Russia, do they not fear in Yerevan that the fate of Georgia and Ukraine will repeat?

Khzmalyan answers that Armenia and Azerbaijan have already been through this. "It began with us in 1988: destabilization in the region, the collapse of the Soviet Union, the 4-year war in Karabakh, the transfer of huge masses of people from Armenia to Azerbaijan and vice versa. That is all that we may fear already. Therefore, it should not be afraid," said Khzmalyan. What will happen if Moscow supports Baku in the Karabakh conflict in order to punish Armenia?

This question surprises Khzmalyan, who replies that Moscow, in fact, supports only its own interests. "In this case, Armenia and Azerbaijan are instruments for holding Russian interests. Something similar happened already during the April 2016 war. In our opinion, this operation was coordinated by the General Staff and the military-political leadership of Russia. If you look at the map, it is easy to see that the strikes were carried out in the north and south of Karabakh – in the immediate vicinity of the Baku-Ceyhan pipeline and near the Iranian border. By the time these events coincide with the activation in Syria. Moscow"s local interests are clear – control over oil and gas flows. Then, Serzh Sargsyan was required to do one thing – to call for help from the Russian peacekeepers, which he refused to do. On April 5, one day after the signing of the truce, Sargsyan flew not to Moscow, but to Berlin, where he made a sensational statement, which few people noticed. He said that from now on Armenia has no political patrons," said Khzmalyan, who regards this statement as stating that from now on Armenia cannot maintain allied relations with Russia.

According to him, the consent of Armenia and Azerbaijan to bring peacekeepers to the conflict region will allow Moscow to control not only Azerbaijani oil and gas routes, but also possible transportation of hydrocarbons to the West from Iran, Syria and other regions. However, neither Armenia nor Azerbaijan agreed to such a proposal, preferring a fragile truce.

At the same time, Khzmalyan did not rule out the likelihood of punishing Armenia with the hands of Azerbaijan, although he believes that the Armenian side is well prepared to repel the attack.

"This well-prepared operation did not lead to any strategic changes. On the contrary, the reaction of our society was very interesting when the masses of volunteers went to the front. In society, even 25 years later, a consensus remained on this issue. Therefore, we do not exclude such an option, but we are not afraid of it," says Khzmalyan.

What will be if Russia raises the price of gas from $ 165 to $ 200-250? Khzmalyan says that the real price for gas today is already 300 dollars. "Up to the border of Armenia, the gas comes for $ 165, and then transferred to 100% of the Russian structure of Rosarmgazprom, which sells it to consumers at a different price. For ordinary consumers, this price is $ 300 per thousand cubic meters. That is, in fact, Russia sells gas to us very expensive, more expensive than, for example, Ukraine," Khzmalyan says.

He sees a way out of the situation in gas purchases from neighboring Iran. "Why drag oil and gas over three thousand kilometers, when less than 300 km. from Yerevan there is a reliable partner – Iraq, which supplies gas at a much cheaper price – $ 100. It is noteworthy that even this pipe, through which gas comes from Iran, belongs to Gazprom. However, in the case of force majeure, no one and no one will prevent Armenia from breaking this enslaving contract, "our interlocutor believes.

What will happen if the Armenian citizens will not be able to live and work under the conditions created by Russia, and will be forced to return? Khzmalyan said on this question that he does not exclude the possibility that Russia will blackmail Armenia with this issue. During the war with Georgia in 2008, hundreds of thousands of Georgians experienced similar pressure in Russia. Therefore, we should not allow people to become hostages of this situation. "Russia is experiencing a serious economic crisis, is under strong sanctions, earnings there are falling and Russia has been able to, like the Soviet Union on the eve of the collapse.

Oil prices are controlled by the United States, which has turned from a buyer into a major seller of hydrocarbons. On the other hand, the events in Venezuela will lead to the fact that this country will also cease to be an ally of Russia and fall under the influence of the West. Therefore, countries relying only on oil will soon find themselves in a difficult situation.

In addition to reducing the price of oil, the United States is starting a new arms race, which the Russian economy will simply not survive. "Therefore, our compatriots either themselves will guess that they should return, or the Russian authorities will explain this to them by their repressions. However, the return of a million or one and a half million for Armenia is not a disaster, but even very good. This is a painful question, but in no case should it influence the choice of sovereignty," Khzmalyan stressed.

Threat and blackmail can achieve the goal for a short time. However, to build long-term politics on blackmail is impossible. "The younger generation of Armenia will never agree with this, they do not want to live in a slave position. No matter what the great powers do, we must get out of this colonial dependence, from those structures that preserve it – this is the CSTO and EurAsEC, frankly hostile to us and in parallel to develop cooperation with Europe.

If we briefly describe our program, then it is:

1) Armexit – Armenia"s withdrawal from Eurasia and the CSTO;

2) Armenter – Armenia"s entrance to the European Union and NATO;

3) Renovation – European integration with infrastructure and legislative changes in the political field based on European standards. These are our strategic objectives and our generation is obliged to do this," says Khzmalyan.

How can Armenia survive without Russia in the presence of a conflict with Azerbaijan and a closed border with Turkey? Our interlocutor answered this question; it will help the example of Georgia.

After the rapprochement of Georgia with the European Union, its citizens were able to move freely and live in Europe. The Armenians of Georgia took advantage of this and this significantly reduced tensions in Javakheti (Armenian-populated region of Georgia – ed.) The question disappeared when one of the countries found itself in another civilization field, in this case, European. Armenians appreciated the value of the Georgian passport and the interethnic conflict, fueled by Russia in this region, has disappeared.

How should the conflict with Azerbaijan be resolved? To this, Khzmalyan replies that this requires a direct dialogue between sovereign and democratic countries. "If this is not the case, then we can only talk about a truce, and not a long-term peace. As for Armenia, it should become independent, freed from occupation and colonial pressure. Only after this negotiations will be worth something. Now you are talking not with Yerevan, but with Moscow, and everything happens with full control and dictate of Russia," Khzmalyan says.

If we talk about principles, then the world should be based on universal human values, on respect for the rights and freedoms of the individual. "I think that our two nations, having millennial neighbors, will find a solution acceptable to our peoples and states," says Khzmalyan.

On the question of whether he represents Nagorno-Karabakh as part of Azerbaijan, he says a categorical "no."

"There is a common opinion in the Armenian society. Moreover, any government that accepts such an opinion will not last 24 hours in power, including the current one," the leader of the European Party of Armenia stressed. -02B-

Yerevan / 12.02.19 / Turan: The political changes that have taken place in Armenia lately were in line with the spirit and desires of the Armenian nation to be a democratic country. Armenia maintains obligations under international agreements and documents that it has signed. The adviser to the President of Armenia Tevan Poghosyan said this in an interview with Turan, answering the question of how Yerevan"s foreign policy changed after the change of power in the country after the velvet revolution.

"There could be no sharp turns in foreign policy. Nikol Pashinyan himself, while still not completely appointed to the post of prime minister, has repeatedly stated that continuity will continue and there will be no drastic changes in foreign policy," noted Pogosyan. The biggest task of the authorities today is the fulfillment of the obligations that were given to voters. The same task is facing those parties that have been elected to parliament and will have to prove that they are able to implement their electoral programs.

How can we explain the obvious lurch towards the West by the new government of Armenia and the criticism of the opposition and a number of experts, that rapprochement with the West and simultaneous removal from Russia is dangerous and Moscow can punish Armenia for this? Answering this question, Pogosyan said that such allegations are unfounded. "The Prime Minister has repeatedly said that the new government will remain committed to strengthening the Armenian-Russian relations. We are members of the Eurasian Economic Union (EurAsEC) and the Collective Security Treaty (CSTO), and will strengthen our positions there. Nobody is going to refuse it.

However, at the same time, we have signed an agreement on comprehensive cooperation with the European Union, and Armenia will reform its management system and carry out reforms.

We are the only member of the CSTO, which has a partnership agreement with NATO (IPAP) and we will maintain these contacts and cooperate in two directions," the adviser said.

Will Armenia sign the Association Agreement with the European Union? Pogosyan responded, "This question is not discussed today".

This agreement provides not only political issues, but also a "deep trade and economic component" (DCFTA), but Armenia has already chosen Eurasia. Therefore, if there are changes in the Associative Document, then perhaps in the future, Armenia will show interest, the counselor believes.

Ex-President of Armenia Robert Kocharian openly says that Pashinyan"s policy is unacceptable, it spoils relations with Russia and Armenia will be punished for this.

Similar assessments are heard at various levels from Moscow. There is an opinion that the increase in gas prices for Armenia, the not entirely correct behavior of the Russian military, who arranged military equipment on the territory of the Armenian village and caused panic, is regarded as a manifestation of this discontent of Russia. How justified are such estimates?

According to the counselor, similar incidents happened before with other authorities as well. "We must take measures so that they do not happen again and no one thought that it will be unpunished."

When Nikol Pashinyan came to power, people did not know him, for many he was unpredictable. However, over time, pursuing a specific policy, the new government looks different, and it is clear that the Armenian leader keeps his word and in all countries realize that he is predictable and Armenia is moving in the "right direction".

"We must pursue our interests and when everyone sees this, when doubts leave, then there will be respect and allied relations between Armenia and Russia," the adviser to the head of Armenia makes an interesting conclusion. That is, the struggle for the "interests of Armenia" is not a greeting to the repetition of the fate of Georgia and Ukraine.

"History has taught us many lessons in order not to repeat mistakes. We will follow our interests, trying to be predictable, honestly talking everything with our allies," says Poghosyan.

Armenia is heavily dependent on Russia economically, which owns almost the entire infrastructure of Armenia. What will be the concept of economic development of the country under the new government?

The adviser replies to this that in the near future the government will submit its economic concept to the parliament. "I am sure that there will be a lot of interesting offers. One of the areas will be the information technology sector, tourism, education, trade with the countries of Eurasia, Iran and Georgia, investments from the Armenian diaspora, the development of medium and small businesses, and agriculture.

In the current situation, Armenia is becoming attractive for investments in the area of its openness and all doubts will disappear. With the right policy, we can become a bridge between the European market and the Eurasian market," said Poghosyan. Today, Armenia"s foreign debt is about 6 billion dollars, the population has fallen to 2 million people (and by some estimates it is even less), social tension in the society is growing against the background of a low standard of living. Is all this is the result of poor governance or an objective outcome, because of the conflict with Azerbaijan?

On this question, the presidential adviser said that there is a crisis all over the world in Turkey and Azerbaijan, Iran and the CIS countries, Europe and America.

"The external debt of Armenia is not so big; there are countries where there is a terrible debt at all.

Of course, the blockade on the part of Turkey and Azerbaijan is having an effect. There are, of course, subjective and objective reasons for the current situation. We hope that the new government program and the fight against corruption and the national spirit will help to overcome many problems. As for demography, over the past 9 months, the trend has changed in the direction of increasing the number of arrivals, and not those who have departed from the country,"the adviser said optimistically.

When asked how he sees the settlement of the conflict with Azerbaijan, Pogosyan said that Azerbaijan should sit at the negotiating table with Armenia and Karabakh. "Although, I am sure that Baku, Yerevan and Karabakh will now stand firm and all have a long way to go to hear each other. This may be 10 and 100 years, but this is the only way. If you choose war, there will be war, choose peace – there will be peace." Where is the red line for the Armenians, from which they will not refuse and will not retreat? To this question, the presidential adviser answered: "There can be no concessions on the issue of security and recognition of the status that guarantees the security of the Armenians of Karabakh.

In general, until we understand that we just need to communicate, the red line is everywhere. "

How is the settlement formula perceived in Armenia – territories in exchange for status?

The presidential adviser gave a negative answer to this. According to him, it would be possible to talk about this after the conclusion of a truce in 1994. "Then the answer would be completely different."

According to him, the Armenian side will not go to the liberation of the territories around Karabakh in order to ensure its security – in order to prevent the front line from approaching Karabakh itself.

"If you convince the Karabakh people that you are not going to attack, then it may be possible to agree. It is possible that the efforts of two or three generations will go to this," Pogosyan said.

To the question, whether he excludes that in the event of a new war, the Armenian side may lose not only the territories around Karabakh, but also Karabakh itself, the presidential adviser says that nothing can be ruled out. "But the losses will not only be with us and the process will not stop there. How much can you hold some territory? We have been waiting for 70 years to regain Karabakh.

We will have to wait. I, my son, my grandson will return these territories. In any case, I will teach them this," the adviser to the President of Armenia concludes the conversation. -02B-