VICTOR OGANOV INTERVIEW: THE ‘DESTROYER’ SAYS, "MY DREAM IS TO WIN A FIGHT ON POINTS. HONESTLY, THAT IS WHAT I TRAIN TO DO!"
East Side Boxing
374&more=1
June 19 2007
19.06.07 – By Izyaslav "Slava" Koza: Those that have been with me
from the beginning, know that I try to focus on helping the boxing
world meet up with, and find out about fighters, whose career, style,
or personality are worth keeping an eye on. Since this is the standard
by which I interview guys, there should always be something intriguing
about any single person that takes the time out to speak with us.
The question that unbearably has to be asked is what makes Victor
Oganov so special? I think the fans on this site are too smart to be
fooled by a pretty professional record without much substance.
Personally, I can’t blame them because, after all, that is a logical
concern for fans who invest their time in watching a certain boxer
progress through the ranks on his way to a title or the trash. Anyone
can clearly see that Oganov’s opponents to date are, in the most
generous of terms, sub-par in nature. Although I will not focus on
the excuses regarding this, I will say that as with most guys who
are not famous amateurs, managing and promotion are always and always
will be major issues.
That does not change the facts regarding his opposition, but neither
does it alter the facts that each of them went down via KO or TKO.
Considering that many top ranked media darlings usually find a guy
able to take them the distance, Oganov has not. That, by the way,
includes, Richard Grant who has generally been a durable distance
trial horse for many good fighters, including Jeff Lacy, who could
only get by Grant with a decision. Oganov did the job in two rounds.
Even so I can still see the most villainous critics sitting there
staring at the screen and saying, "so what, Mr. Koza, you need to give
me more then Johnny gave Ito in the O.J trial," seeing as I have not
presented my big Ace for the intriguing reason behind my getting in
touch with the "Destroyer."
That reason?
I have never heard of or seen an amateur fighter who has won all
of his amateur bouts by stoppage or a TKO based victory. Yes, even
that opposition was not loud to a degree, but show me guys who have
had more then say 20 amateur bouts who crushed all their victims,
not on points, but on punches. Even though Victor humbles himself in
that regard, and does rightfully point to his losses, I am not even
remotely as modest as him.
What his amateur record tells me is he was MOLDED for the professional
ranks, and for giving fans exactly what they want to see. Doesn’t
that make everybody just a least bit curious about what this kid can
do against better fighters?
I know I am.
ESB: Alright, Victor, let’s start with the fresher stuff. Just over
the past few days, the bout against Echols was cancelled. Can you
tell us why?
Victor Oganov: We couldn’t agree with the company organizing the
fight. Recently, I signed a contract with a bigger promotional
organization that I think can do more for my career. That company
is Gary Shaw Promotions, which also represents the interests of my
friend Vakhtang "Vic" Darchinyan.
I was just at the office today, shook hands and verified all the
details. My next fight should be finalized for the end of July or
the beginning of August.
ESB: Some fans wanted me to ask you about your plan for the Echols
fight, and even though it was cancelled, I think the question is
still valid. I know that this information is usually not discussed
before a bout. However, I will ask why there are some guys who aren’t
afraid at all to discuss it, while there are those who don’t want to
no matter what?
Victor Oganov: Every guy has his own reasons, but I think it very wise
not to give away your game plan before a fight. I also don’t like to,
for instance, give disinformation. Why do that? We’ll just see in
the ring. It will always be more interesting that way.
ESB: What differences do you notice between the personalities of the
former and the latter?
Victor Oganov: Well, it’s show-business so there is nothing
extra-ordinary here. Really you can’t even consider such statements as
realistic thoughts. For instance, I read on one site, don’t remember
which, that I was going to knock Echols out in some round and that
Tyson was going to be in my corner, right?
I was very surprised. That is the first time that I have heard about
it and I don’t even the source of that information.
ESB: Whom would you want to fight against next?
Victor Oganov: We’ll see. There are many fighters in my weight who
are very good almost one being better then the other you know. Out
of the 15 best, I might be 9th or so, and it will depend on my team,
and who I will fight in order to get a few places higher. Other than
that, who do you we have there? Calzaghe is obviously the target for
everybody else.
ESB: Do you think you are ready for a championship bout? (Our
conversation is interrupted by a phone call from Jeff Fenech. I am
impressed to find that Victor speaks English quite well.)
Victor Oganov: I don’t think that I have to fight for a title right
at this moment, although I won’t turn it down, or run away from such
an opportunity, if I am offered such a fight. If there is good money,
then of course.
I mean what serious fighter, prepared or unprepared, will turn down
the opportunity of not only becoming a champion, but jumping to a
level where he will be getting bigger purses?
I think that guys like, Joe Calzaghe, and Kessler, are not really
that different from many of the top fighters including me. They
are all boxers, and they are all normal people like those of us who
are lower down in the ratings. Yea they have a title, and a fight
with them is more important for us, perhaps, but to me personally,
it doesn’t make a difference.
ESB: It seems you are saying that fighters on the elite level are to
a degree all of the same pedigree.
Victor Oganov: Yeah, in a sense.
If I get offered relatively good money then I will be happy to right
now, of course. At the moment, though, what I really think I need is
to spend more time in America. I’m here for the second time and am
happy with the atmosphere, and the fact that America is the center of
professional boxing, and that there are a lot of good boxers with whom
I can train. In Australia, I had a lot of problems with training and
sparring partners, but here I am starting to really prepare well, and
spar, and in that way see much greater and more definitive progress.
ESB: One of the questions that some have asked regarding you, is
that relative to the ordinary age of a boxer, you are passing into
one where fighters usually start thinking about hanging ’em up. Do
you think that is one of the reasons why it is important to take a
step towards serious fights right now?
Victor Oganov: No, no, I don’t think about it as if my time has
come and all that. Of course, at 20, I didn’t think that I would be
fighting at 30, but every person has their own fate and their own
time. I feel great now. Like everybody, I had unsuccessful experiments
with different managers, promoters, where it didn’t allow me to get
into top form. For that, you need a series of fights where you can
feel your true strengths and fully master your style of fighting.
I know that I can be even better and that I just need to concentrate
on my training and have time to reach my peak potential.
ESB: Right now the biggest and most important fight at your weight
is Calzaghe vs. Kessler. Who do you think will win if they meet?
Victor Oganov: I think Calzaghe. Why? Well, first of all, when it
doesn’t concern me, I try not to involve myself in other business.
When I don’t fight, I like to take time away from boxing. I’m not an
analyst, and I don’t like to break down plans or what not, because
in the end, it will depend on the two guys in the ring, anyway.
That said, personally, I lean towards Calzaghe. He is more emotional ,
more assertive, and it seems that whatever happens he can show more
character in any situation. Kessler seems more cold-blooded, and
calmer, and I just don’t think he can add that much to his character.
In other words, I don’t see that many energetic bursts in his manner
of fighting.
ESB: You want to say that if he will start losing he won’t try,
or won’t be able, to adjust his game-plan?
Victor Oganov: Well, yeah, in other words I think the fight will be
about even, maybe with a slight advantage for Calzaghe, with Kessler
not being able to adapt.
ESB: Ok, tell us about your trainer Jeff Fenech. How are you working
together?
Victor Oganov: I am happy with Jeff. I was really surprised by
what a good trainer he is. When I trained at the Kostya Tsyzu
boxing academy, I think I was a worse fighter than I am now. It’s
possible that the training method there was wrong in the sense that,
the workload there was huge, and while it seemed right at the time,
that quantity doesn’t bring in quality so to speak. I didn’t exactly
like that kind of an arrangement.
With Jeff, though, see, he gives me more attention and a lot more
of his time, so much so that sometimes we even start getting on each
other’s nerves. Even then, I think I am lucky because he doesn’t have
anybody right now and he can give more attention to me in particular.
I respect him as a trainer and as a boxer. He was a great fighter
back then, especially as most people know, with his fights against
Azumah Nelson, and others of course, and coincidentally a lot of
characteristics in his style help me in my career. He is one of these
former fighters who know boxing. He sees the whole fight in his head
and can give good advice during it, and during sparring as well.
ESB: I read that Jeff thinks other Australian based fighters like
Green and Mundine are afraid to get into the ring with you. Do you
think so as well?
Victor Oganov: Of course, there is a risk. I wouldn’t say they are
afraid, because we are all fighters and people after all, but there
is a risk against me, yes. I think that they are more businessmen and
consider the amount they will earn versus the actual risk against a
certain opponent. So if they only see a big risk in it, they won’t
do it just so they can shut somebody up.
Otherwise there is just a risk, cause after all I do have a puncher’s
style.
ESB: Mundine is especially one of these guys who love to talk a lot.
I remember before the fight with Ottke he was shouting that Ottke’s
punch is no better then a little girl’s. The result being that Sven’s
punch left him without consciousness. Do you think if Ottke could
take him down that you could do much worse?
Victor Oganov: Well, I don’t remember all the details about the punch
and the little girl, but I do think if Ottke could do it, then I
could do even better (laughing). I don’t know how Ottke got the job
done, maybe it was a miracle, though I do remember he got him in the
temple. I saw the KO, of course. It was quite ironic (laughing).
ESB: Did you ever spar with Mundine?
Victor Oganov: No, but I did spar with Green when he was getting ready
for the first fight with Markus Beyer. Danny is very self-confident,
and Mundine like played a bad joke on him, and when Danny boxed against
him, you could see that self-confidence, was his Achilles’ heel,
because he should have been craftier and not so straightforward. That
is why Mundine sort of tricked him.
ESB: You are talking about him as if you are friends. What sort of
relationship do you have?
Victor Oganov: With Green? Yeah, we have a mutual friend and have met
a couple of times. I don’t have anything against him, not him, nor
Mundine, by the way. Even when we met a few times, I was surprised by
how different he acts. Usually you know he yells to the whole country
and has this talkative attitude. You know he makes it a show of sorts.
I treat everybody with respect, including my own as well as potential
future opponents. I don’t like to insult anybody or wind up before
a fight.
ESB: In boxing, or rather in Western boxing, there is this
understanding of "God Given Power." In other words, punchers are born
and aren’t made in boxing gyms. Do you think that you were born with
a strong punch, or that training, and trainer’s advice helped you
develop it much better.
Victor Oganov: Yeah, it’s a natural characteristic, and I would even
say that I don’t think I’ve fully developed my potential.
ESB: Are you happy at this weight, or are there plans to jump a
division higher?
Victor Oganov: Yeah, very much so, and I feel very good at this
weight. I fought at different ones but, unquestionably, I am much
faster at Super Middleweight. I would also add that muscle mass
doesn’t help speed.
ESB: Yeah, like we saw in the Ibragimov vs. Briggs fight, Shannon was
really bothered by his own mass and moved much worse around the ring.
Victor Oganov: I didn’t see the fight, was a little busy, but the
rules in that division are completely different relative to weight.
Of course, it’s also true that Briggs is too big and gets tired and
needs to drop a few kilo’s.
ESB: For now, though, you don’t have plans to move up or down in
weight?
Victor Oganov: No, no, although I could fight with light-heavies if
the money will be there and all that, but even then, I am quite short,
and I don’t think I would be as affective against those guys.
ESB: Did you ever think about a hypothetical fight where some opponent
"X" can take your shots and your only way out is to win on points?
Victor Oganov: Yeah, yeah, my dream is to win a fight on points.
Honestly, that is what I train to do. You know, even though there
are instances where I hit an opponent in the head and he can take the
shot, I end up finishing him anyway due to accumulation. I basically
hit anything, arms, body, wherever.
ESB: It’s interesting because your record shows that all your fights
are recorded as won by TKO.
Victor Oganov: Is that based on the information off of boxrec? In
truth, they make mistakes sometimes because even though I won via
clean KO, they still record it as a TKO based victory.
ESB: Well, then I think the details aren’t that important, because,
for instance, if a guy is lying there unconscious, why should a referee
give a count? There were these fights where a guy is lying motionless
or, even indicating to the ref that he won’t get up and the ref still
counts to 10. I mean why? Officially, it could have been a TKO win,
where they just stopped it outright but could, theoretically, count
to 20 even.
Victor Oganov: Yeah, yeah, as I mentioned, there were fights that were
recorded as a TKO, while the guy was just completely down and out,
and it was basically a clean KO.
ESB: Now some questions regarding your sparring: I read that while
sparring against Paul Briggs, you broke his ribs. Can you tell us
what happened?
Victor Oganov: I didn’t break anything, that didn’t happen. Again,
somebody was just inflating things again, but I did not break any
ribs. In fact, I am very appreciative and grateful to Paul because
he helped me out very often when I boxed there, and I respect him and
his trainer Johnny Lewis a great deal. We sparred three or four times
but nobody broke anything. Matter of fact, somebody broke my ribs.
ESB: Ah, yes, I read that a guy named Lawrence Tuasa did it.
Victor Oganov: Yeah, Lawrence hit me in the wrong spot and I had to
recuperate for a month, but thank God, I recovered and everything is
fine now.
ESB: Who were your more famous sparring partners?
Victor Oganov: The most famous was probably Roma Karmazin. When I was
in Germany, I worked with Arthur Abraham. Other then that, I can only
remember that I did some rounds with Julio Gonzalez.
ESB: I read that you are often criticized for forgetting about defense
in your fights. Would you call that fair?
Victor Oganov: No, why do I forget about defense? That’s not true.
Depending on how much I can feel the punches, and depending on how
much my opponent allows me to do it, it may seem that way. Depending on
how confident I am in myself, you know. I never forget about defense.
I don’t want to glorify the idea that I somehow have this chin of
granite and, "Here you go, hit me as much as you want," but I just try
to feel out what I can get hit with and what I can’t. For instance,
if my opponent throws something you can’t call a meaningful punch,
and I open up a bit, or make a head movement, that may give the fans
that sort of impression.
In fact, I treat this aspect of boxing very seriously and don’t really
like to get hit. Other then that I guess you can say that I need to
work more and train and train.
ESB: Ok, now some questions regarding your amateur career. Who were
some of your more famous opponents?
Victor Oganov: Well, not anybody too famous, but there is a guy now,
Valeri Brudov, who is now boxing at just under 81 kg, who I fought
three times. I won once and lost twice. We were like from the same
area in Russia, Pskov region, and so he was my most famous opponent.
We are on good terms, and after I turned pro, he was still boxing
amateur in St. Petersburg, and now boxes at Cruiserweight, right?
Anyway, I wish him luck, and I have very fond memories about our
amateur days.
Then there were some guys, who are probably not famous names,
like Bagdashkin, Egor, multiple winner of the Russian national
championships, and that is about it.
To be honest, my amateur career wasn’t very successful. After all,
I was from a secondary city, and didn’t have as many opportunities,
relatively speaking. I was at the national championships only twice
and didn’t do too well, losing in the first round bouts. I am very
grateful to my first trainer, Fedor Laer, who also brought up and
trained heavyweight Champion of the USSR, Vladimir Balai, who was
also from our city. Then, at the 86 Goodwill Games, he came in second,
and did beat future pro champ Michael Bent.
ESB: Even so, what is curious about your amateur career is this:
in professional boxing there are instances where you see fighters
who have all wins coming by KO, but for that boxer to also have all
victories come by way of KO in amateur boxing, is probably completely
unheard of at all.
Victor Oganov: Well, they weren’t clean KO’s, of course, stoppages,
towels, two knockdown rule and all that because the rules were
strictly enforced.
ESB: You know, still you sometimes see a guy who has 50% of his
amateur wins by way of KO, and that is rare in itself, and says
something about his power, but your KO percentage is 100%.
Victor Oganov: Well those are TKO’s. In other words, yeah, that is
my style and, of course, when I land, it’s over (laughing).
ESB: Do you think it’s harder to drop somebody in amateur boxing?
Victor Oganov: Yeah, I think it’s harder, but again there are different
rules there and you can’t even do it all the time. Always a break in
the action, or a pause, or the ref giving a warning, and it makes it
harder to finish somebody sometimes.
In a practical sense, it’s a different sport, different judging
standards, and really it was hard for me to win on points cause
I threw fewer punches but they were heavy. At the same time, my
opponents piled up the points with weak shots.
ESB: I pose this question to all ex-Soviet fighters whom I interview:
Who do you think is the greatest Soviet era boxer of all time and why?
Victor Oganov: Good God, what a question. If I was very knowledgeable
in this subject area, maybe I could give a worthy answer, but,
unfortunately, I don’t know too much about it. Well…..(deep breath)
probably our Olympic champs, many of whom, living and not, I heard
about in my younger days. Popenchenko, was a very extraordinary
fighter, then Victor Ageev, who was very talented.
ESB: I think everyone meets one personality, one name, that leaves
the deepest impression.
Victor Oganov: Well, Kostya Tsyzu did a lot, or not really that he
did something unbelievable, but the one who was recognized for it so
to speak. We parted ways, but even so, as a boxer he has to be given
his dues, in the later years at least.
I really liked Lebzyak when he boxed. More so, actually, the
manner in which he communicated with other people left a pleasant
impression. Then when he won a Gold Medal, Oleg Saitov, who I
show great respect for that accomplishment. I can’t say there is a
particular leader, because I am respectful towards everybody. Yura
Aleksandrov, a special fighter, who is doing something related to
boxing even now. We have a lot of good guys in Russia, including
those who accomplish things through hard work, or through talent,
but I can’t say that I have one single leader or even one idol.
It also depends on the guy’s image, because a guy can be a victim
of that, and only something you see personally can be considered the
very best.
ESB: Well then maybe I should change the question a bit and ask who
you liked the best, and who made the greatest impression on you.
Victor Oganov: Even then, I can’t say because I started late in
boxing and saw very few of our fighters. I saw Kurnyavka and others,
and, of course, I was happy when they won, but from the older guys,
I did not see much of their archived bouts. Maybe if I could watch
them now, I could realistically say, ‘oh, yeah, he was really the
best.’ I don’t know…You are giving me this riddle to solve.
ESB: (Laughing) Yeah, I understand, but even so everyone names
one person, like Timur Ibragimov said Lemeshev, Dima Kirrilov said
Popenchenko, Vasili Jirov named Korolev. Just those fighters they
read about, heard about, saw, and remembered more so than others.
Victor Oganov: Korolev, yeah, that is another name, of course. In
fact, I will say Korolev, because a person like that who fought in
and survived the war, and even boxed well afterwards, and tried to
challenge Joe Louis to a fight, yeah? That in reality is the type of
character, that deserves such a rank.
Yeah, I will name Korolev, and you do have to give him his due,
for trying to organize a professional bout of such caliber at that
point in time. Then he had that series of bouts against Shotzikas,
who was either a professor,or a graduate student in a university,
and that just begs respect.
ESB: You are the second fighter, who I am speaking with in the last
few weeks, who is supposedly acquainted with Mike Tyson.
Victor Oganov: No, no, I don’t know him. Jeff knows him and they are
friends, and I heard he is a good guy, a regular person, but I don’t
know him.
In my youth, I was very impressed with him, and I never thought that
when I become older I would even have the opportunity to meet him.
ESB: As I understand it, you have Armenian roots, right? This is
probably not something that is known to many Armenian Americans,
the Diaspora of which is quite large here. Do you think that will
help draw Armenian fight fans to your bouts?
Victor Oganov: Yeah, my dad is Armenian. Of course, I have Armenian
blood in me, and that is something that is very evident in my
character, especially in the ring and in my style of fighting.
ESB: You know, all Armenian fighters are really considered punchers
in a sense. For instance, Vakhtang "Vic" Darchinyan, and then Arthur
Abraham. In other words it’s something that characterizes Armenian
fighters. I just never heard of them being fighters like a Spinks,
for example.
Victor Oganov: Well, Vic in fact is very technical too, plus he has
a very good left, a very strong punch. Besides which he estimates
distance in the ring very well, and that is why he can be so affective
in his style.
ESB: You know I don’t think enough people give him his due. Some say
he works in only one dimension, which isn’t really fair because he is
very unique in his style and does many little things in the ring. All
fighters work in one dimension if he does. I mean, he has his personal
stance and way of figting, like all good fighters, so in that sense
all the best guys of past and present were one-dimensional.
Victor Oganov: He is very uncomfortable to fight, of course. He has
his own style, he’s a lefty, and that is not valued correctly. He
dominates greatly at his weight.
ESB: I wanted to ask you about your family, and kids.
Victor Oganov: Yep. Well, my wife, Svetlana, a little younger,
and from my town of Syktyvkar, is a very good person and I am lucky
to have her. My daughter, Anna, will soon be seven, while my son,
Semyon, named in honor of grandfather and father, is one and a half,
and was born in Australia. I am very happy with them and love my kids
and wife deeply. They are the closest people to me and I worry about
them all the time.
My brother’s called Armen (laughing) which is a very Armenian name.
He lives and works in Moscow now. My mom lives in Syktyvkar.
ESB: With which famous fighters are you friends?
Victor Oganov: Well, Vakhtang, besides being a great boxer, is a close
friend of mine. That I came to Australia, and that I liked it there,
is really his doing. If he was not there, I probably wouldn’t have
come back a second or third time. We are really close friends.
I grew up in Russia, and had these impressions regarding people in
different social groups, you know in Russian, and in Armenian ones.
However, when I met him he just exceeded all my expectations regarding
people in general. Neither among Armenians, nor Russians, can you
meet a person of such quality. He has a heart made of gold and is a
very good friend. From the bottom of my soul I am profoundly grateful
that I met him and have the honor of calling him my friend.
That he is such a fighter, and champion, and so strong, to me
personally does not mean a whole lot. For me the most important thing
is our relationship.
Then who else? I can’t say that among my circle of acquaintances there
are other famous fighters, but there are guys who I am on good terms
with. For example Kolya Valuev.
Also, even though he is not a boxer, I have to unquestionably mention
the support I get from Eduard Gumashian. I am living at his place now,
and he completely helps me, watches out for me, drives me everywhere,
does the necessary massages, and other similar procedures. Right
now, he manages Vakhtang (Vic), Vadim Tokarev, and Rustam Nugaev,
but besides that also voluntarily works as my advisor here, and I am
very grateful and thankful to him for it.
ESB: Victor, I think we discussed a lot with you today. Anything to
add or pass along to our readers from all over the world, on both
our Russian and English web-sites?
Victor Oganov: Yeah, in reality I love Russia, and last year, when
I parted ways with Kostya, I went back for half a year, and am very
happy with my homeland. I love Russia, and when I hear people speak
ill of it, it gets to me a little, but when people praise it, it
feels good. I don’t know where I will live but time will tell.
Although I do want to add that I am very grateful to Australia and its
people too. In Russia it is harder to develop a professional career
and at the moment there are less opportunities there. In Australia
though it is easier and that is why I am grateful to it as well.
ESB: Victor, we will you luck and further success.
Although Victor did not sign with Fight Academy and Stuart Duncan,
I have to thank them for helping me contact him.
I would also like to thank Victor’s wife Svetlana for sending me the
pictures of Victor you see throughout this article.
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