Doctor of Political Sciences, Professor Vahe Davtyan’s conversation with the Extraordinary and Plenipotentiary Ambassador of Iran to Armenia Khalil Shirgolami.
Vahe Davtyan: Dear Mr. Ambassador, first of all, thank you for the opportunity to have this conversation. I think, taking into account the Armenian-Iranian friendly relations, both you, the diplomats, and we, the representatives of the expert field, should approach the coverage and interpretation of issues and problems of bilateral relations more systematically. It is especially relevant today, when the Israeli-American aggression towards Iran and the escalation in the Middle East create risks for the South Caucasus and, in particular, for Armenia. Let’s start with an assessment of the general situation. How do you assess the dynamics of the conflict, what are your predictions? about it.
Ambassador Khalil Shirgholami.- Look, Israel and America launched a wave of attacks against Iran. They chose this aggression by attacking our country. Our spiritual leader was martyred as a result of their attack, several of our commanders were also killed, and there were even casualties among the civilian population.
They cherished the hope that with this they would break the backbone of the Iranian system and Iran would surrender. As you can see, Iran did not find itself in a crisis situation, the political, administrative and defense systems did not collapse. Within the framework of a calculated strategy, Iran chose American military bases in the region as the target of a counterattack, the purpose of which was to reduce the potential and possibilities of American attacks. We managed to achieve this goal as much as possible.
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Most of the American military bases in the region, on the creation of which America had spent hundreds of millions (according to some estimates, even trillions) of dollars, were destroyed or neutralized. Regarding the Israeli regime, Iran initially launched a large wave of rockets, drones also entered the scene as complementary components. The goal was to identify and neutralize Israel’s defense systems.
In the following stages, most of Israel’s defense and surveillance systems were destroyed. And now the accuracy rate of Iranian missiles is quite high, and the Israeli regime is in a real crisis. In our country, Iran, which is a big country, people provide an active presence on the streets. I’m sure you’ve seen that in the night, despite the constant sounds of bombs and gunshots, people gather to support the defense of the country. At the same time, everyone in Israel is in shelters and basements. life has stopped.
On the other hand, Iran, wanting to further increase the cost of aggression for its aggressor opponents, does not allow any oil tanker to pass through the Strait of Hormuz without Iran’s permission, which creates new costs and problems for the aggressors in the energy sector. I don’t think that this created balance creates an image where Iran can be considered as a defeated party. Iran stands with all its strength, Iran’s defense strategy and calculations are quite accurate. Therefore, we hope that the aggressors will eventually face such high costs that they will have to stop their operations. Naturally, we are worried about the security issues of our neighbors, including Armenia, and all our efforts are focused on ensuring that our friendly countries do not feel the consequences of this situation in any way.
V. Davtyan: Just a few days before the escalation, information was received from Oman that the parties are very close to an agreement on the “nuclear deal”. On February 26, Iranian Foreign Minister Abbas Araghchi also announced progress in the negotiation process. In parallel, the application of the “economic formula” was discussed, which created an atmosphere of positive expectation. Was this a diplomatic maneuver, a product of information warfare, or simply a deception in flagrant violation of international norms? How do you yourself evaluate the negotiation process until February 28?
Ambassador: Looking at the past negotiations, we understand that America was not honest in those negotiations and in the goals it pursued in them. Americans, according to everything, did not have any limits to their desires and expectations. What we saw was that Mr. Witkoff and Mr. Kushner, participating in these negotiations, behind the curtains of the negotiations, called the proposals from the Iranian side good and attractive, but upon returning to their capital, either they did not have the necessary honesty, presenting the provisions in an incomplete, incorrect and negative way, or various factors and lobbying forces in the capital distorted the situation in such a way that Iran is not ready for any concession.
Looking back at this process, we can say that the whole process of negotiations was a big lie by America, which betrayed the principles of diplomacy. And one of the reasons that Iran, despite receiving different messages about the ceasefire, cannot trust America, is the very negotiation process in which America participated with a dishonest position, never looking for a solution, which was obvious and is still noticeable. From the beginning, America was not looking for a solution in these negotiations. We well remember that along with negotiations, Iran was accumulating its weapons and military forces all around. This leads us to a conclusion that for America the negotiations were only a part of the war strategy.
V. Davtyan: Taking this opportunity, I would like to once again express my condolences on the death of Ayatollah Ali Khamenei and at the same time, congratulate you on the election of the new Supreme Leader, Seyed Mojtaba Khamenei. I think this transition is a proof of the existing institutional system in Iran. Hence my question. What effect did the assassination of Iran’s supreme leader have on Iran’s internal socio-political dynamics in the context of military escalation? Can we say that this event contributed to the consolidation of Iranian society around an external threat, and how can it affect political identity, public solidarity and state-society relations?
Ambassador.- In order to understand the nature of Iranian society, it is necessary to have deep and subtle knowledge about Iranian civilization, characteristics and mentality of Iranians. And this is exactly the reason why the West is mistaken in the perception of Iranian society. The principle and accepted idea of the consciousness of the Iranian society is that the spiritual leader of Iran, after a lifetime of struggle, resistance to imperialism and violence, at the age of 86, was martyred in a truly manly manner as a result of enemy aggression. In other words, his last minutes were not spent lying in bed. he chose a heroic death, as befits a man.
Such an Iranian epic conception of death is largely related to the ideas of the Shia religion, the events of Ashura, and the martyrdom of Imam Hossein, which are an integral part of the Iranian Shia epic culture. Our spiritual leader also suffered the death described in the epics, but after his death, people became more united and realized even braver than before that the enemy they are dealing with is capable of murdering the leader of another country in an insane way, violating all international legal and moral norms. The political system of Iran, contrary to the expectations of the enemy, did not collapse and preserved its rigid structure.
Despite the unfavorable security and war conditions, the new spiritual leader was elected by the Assembly of Experts in accordance with the legal mechanism. What is undeniable, the personal characteristics of the new spiritual leader, in addition to the position and desires of the society, will create a complementary system, which, taking into account the prevailing situation and the conditions created around Iran, can define new strategies and views within society, in the governance system and in foreign policy. However, there is one unshakable idea. Iran will not sell its independence to any power, it will not hand over its competence in foreign policy to anyone, and respect for Iran will be the underlying idea of interaction with any country or power.
V. Davtyan: In the Western media discourse, the thesis that Iran’s attacks on the Persian Gulf countries do not lead to significant strategic results is increasingly being strengthened. The approach is also widespread that with such actions, Tehran aims to influence the Gulf countries, to put pressure on the United States through them to end the conflict. How objective is this approach, and what other strategic calculations are at the basis of Iran’s actions?
Ambassador: First of all, it should be emphasized that Iran has not attacked any neighboring country. Iran’s target was exclusively the military bases of the United States in the region, with the help of which the USA carries out its aggression against our country. Under international law, these military bases are considered legitimate targets for retaliation. We consider them military bases under the territorial jurisdiction of the US, not territories subject to the jurisdiction of our neighbors. Therefore, Iran has not carried out any attack against its neighbors.
Furthermore, it is necessary to emphasize that if the West claims that Iran’s strikes on the US military bases in the region had no strategic impact, this carries an important idea. The countries of the West and the USA show complete indifference to the security of these countries. For decades, they have acquired the most advanced and most expensive weapons from America, trying to “buy” their security from the United States, they have “hosted” America in their countries and provided them with many military bases.
However, today it is clear to them that as a result of all this, there is no question of achieving any security and stability. all they got was instability. The claim of Western countries that Iran’s actions “had no impact” means that it does not matter to them what problems these countries will face. only American soldiers and Israel’s security are important to them. This is a sad conclusion that these countries have reached.
However, from our point of view, the situation is like this. in the region, especially the Persian Gulf region, which is considered one of the world’s main energy sources, felt the shock of this situation from the energy point of view. Iran has been able to noticeably limit the operations of the US military bases, because most of them have already been neutralized and are not operationally suitable. This has helped Iran implement its self-defense more effectively.
We hope that in the future, the countries of the region, which have already realized that the US is only a source of instability, will strive for solutions based on real collective security, push the US out of the region and allow governance mechanisms based on indigenous cultural principles to be formed in the region.
V. Davtyan: Who are the real allies of Iran today in the conditions of the current military escalation? Can we talk about the practical support provided by Russia and China to Tehran, or is this support mostly limited to political statements? How would you assess Iran’s relations with these two superpowers in the current crisis, and can they be described as full strategic cooperation?
Ambassador: As for Iran’s allies, it should be noted that we do not have an “ally” in the sense traditionally accepted in international politics. We are a country endowed with our unique characteristics in this very complex and difficult region. Naturally, from the cultural and political point of view, some countries are closer to us, and some are far away. Russia and China are important partners and friends of Iran. We had and have cooperation in the economic, political and defense spheres. However, Iran does not really expect direct and direct participation in war operations or assistance from any country. Because our perceptions of the problem are not the same.
In addition, the potential of Iran is quite large. It is natural that Iran may have certain expectations that its friendly countries provide support in technological and other ways, which has been fulfilled to some extent. However, Iran does not have an “ally” in the classical sense that you mean. And we do not need others to be involved in this war on our side, based on our interests. Naturally, they carry out their actions based on their own interests.
However, we understand and believe that neutralizing Iran in this region is the first step for the US to contain China. I don’t know whether the Chinese realize it or not, but if they neutralize Iran in the Middle East and take control of the energy sources in the region, they will gain the most important advantage in the future to fight against China in the energy sector. In this situation, China will be the main loser, and of course, Russia will also be affected by this situation.
V. Davtyan: If we talk not only about the global but also the regional level, then who are the main partners and allies of Iran today? What is the role of Yemen’s Houthis and “Hezbollah” in this context? Can we say that in the conditions of the current escalation, a network of regional confrontation is forming around Iran, and to what extent are these forces ready to systematically support Tehran at the political, military or strategic levels?
Ambassador.- As for the resistance movements, the United States and the Zionist regime claimed that the resistance in the region has died down. They forget that resistance is an idea, an ideal and a concept. Resistance is not only a physical phenomenon. As long as violence, occupation and imperialist behavior continue to exist, resistance in the region will continue to exist and be expressed.
Today we see that various resistance movements are active in Iraq, Yemen and Lebanon. We are sure that they are part of the struggle against the occupation and the violent actions of the USA and Israel and are fighting against their aggression within the limits of their capabilities.
Therefore, anyone who is realistic will understand that these movements, which are genuine and formed on the basis of the idea of resistance to violence and occupation, cannot be suppressed or destroyed. Even now they have their role and are the natural allies of Iran fighting against American imperialism and the violent nature of the Zionist regime.
V. Davtyan: The closure of the Strait of Hormuz led to a sharp increase in oil prices on the world market. At the same time, there are negative trends in the gas market. To what extent does the closure of that international route contribute to the advancement of Tehran’s geostrategic goals in the conflict? How effective is this strategic lever for influencing the regional power balance and exerting pressure on external actors?
Ambassador.- Look, we are a country that is now exercising self-defense. We have been subjected to brutal attacks by America and the Zionist regime, and some other forces are supporting them. In any case, the world must understand that if there is instability and aggression, their negative consequences will affect everyone. Many people already understand that the illegal and daring behavior of the USA and Israel can create security and economic problems for the whole world.
The Strait of Hormuz is under the control of Iran. In the case of creating a situation of instability around us or carrying out aggression and attack against us, it is natural that we will not allow the forces that carry out this aggression to take advantage of the opportunities of the region and the Persian Gulf. We are sure that this will affect the calculations of the aggressors. It may not be tangible in the short term, but in the medium term its impact will be fully felt. Therefore, Iran has announced that no oil tanker will have the right to pass through the Strait of Hormuz without Iran’s permission.
V. Davtyan: Let’s talk about it South The Caucasus. What? risks are you see of the region for escalation possible to continue conditions. In particular, this stage what? economic and: strategic threats can is already and առանձնացնել՝ account taking of the region communicative, energy and: security vulnerabilities.
Ambassador.- As for the South Caucasus region, it should be noted that America’s actions and its daring behavior have created instability and a security threat in the international system. The European countries, which were America’s close allies, were the first to feel it with their whole being.
Trump’s behavior and illegal actions have become the object of universal hatred. Many, even if they do not express it publicly, have realized that the USA, especially America under the Trump presidency, is a source of instability, threats and lawlessness, as a result of which the world is turning into a jungle. Trump’s similar approach to the South Caucasus, of course, cannot bring peace and stability, because Trump only thinks about his daring interests.
When talking about the aggression against Iran and Iran’s self-defense, it should be noted that all our efforts have been and will continue to be aimed at ensuring that the countries of the region, the countries in the north of Iran, especially our good friend Armenia, do not suffer any impact or damage from these events. This has been and continues to be one of our most serious issues.
Fortunately, our friendly Armenia did not have and does not have any bases aimed at the military or security presence of the USA or the Zionist regime, and our relations are based on mutual trust. We have given a serious warning to other countries in the region, where the military or security presence of the USA or Israel is possible, that under no circumstances should they allow even the slightest aggression against Iran from the territory of those countries. So far this has been maintained. We hope that these rules will continue to be observed, because we want peace and stability to be preserved in the South Caucasus region.
V. Davtyan: This in context I will ask evaluate iran–azerbaijani the relationship, which ones especially last years seriously wildfires are manifestation: days ahead email Nakhichevan civilian objects accomplished the blow was evaluated Baku կողմից՝ as terrorist act: To that followed transportation of transportation termination parties between: A lot is spoken Ադրբեջանի՝ of conflict side to become possibility մասին՝ account taking also israel–azerbaijani deep interaction don’t series strategic directions: And though diplomatic aggravation the climax perhaps overcome Pezeshkian–Aliev from a phone conversation after, however expert in the domain a lot is spoken like of the script development about: I will ask to give yours assessment:
Ambassador.- Look, as I have said before on this topic, if Iran decides to carry out military operations, it will not carry it out secretly. The incident in Nakhijevan was very suspicious for us. It could be a scenario, it could be a “false flag” to create a problem between Iran and its neighbors. Unfortunately, the leaders of the Republic of Azerbaijan were in a hurry, made quick conclusions and quickly came up with a harsh reaction. However, that drastic approach faded quickly, as they realized that they had made a mistake and had not assessed the situation correctly. Most likely, they also realized that this action is very suspicious, and as a result of the conversations that took place, the decisions made were withdrawn.
We announce to our friendly countries in the region to be alert and pay attention to the possible conspiracies of the USA and the Zionist regime, which are aimed at disrupting friendly relations. We have said before that if there is a security or military presence of the USA or the Zionist regime in the territory of Azerbaijan, they should not be used against Iran. We are very firm in this position and have no desire for escalation.
They realized that the drone operation was quite suspicious. Iran’s drones are accurate, focused on defined targets and reach the right target. Therefore, fortunately, we can report that the situation was managed successfully.
V. Davtyan: Let’s talk about it TRIPP-in: official Tehran many times is to announce South In the Caucasus her “red of lines about”: Permanently be highlighted is, that like this called “Zangezuryan the hallway”, now էլ՝ TRIPP-uh unacceptable is her for, how many that restriction is Iran geostrategic and transportation the potential: myself email that in the opinion եմ՝ account taking, that it risks is creates North–South logistic of strategy for, whose under Armenia: can is to become connecting ring Iran interests derived from From Persia bay–Black sea multimodal contact under: Is it reasonable? are you, that today, escalation conditions, TRIPP-in: the dangers email more clear are outlined:
Ambassador: We do not want to make prejudices or prejudices. The Zangezur Corridor had a fundamentally different meaning, considering that it implied an extra-territorial approach to the sovereign territory of Armenia, so we were against it, declared that point of view and showed our support to the Republic of Armenia so that this approach would not win.
Now, the path known as TRIPP with the participation of the USA is natural, considering the involvement of the USA and its constant hostile policy towards Iran, it is natural that Iran feels threatened as a result of the involvement of the USA. Now, more than ever, the scale of the hostile position of the USA against Iran is obvious to everyone.
However, we have discussed this issue with the Armenian authorities, and they have always assured us that this will never turn into a source of threat against Iran. Therefore, we do not make preconceived judgments, and, of course, we are waiting for further developments. At the moment, mutual trust and friendship between the two countries is paramount. We welcome Armenia’s good use of its transport capabilities, from east to west, from north to south. We hope that in this context the transport routes will be opened, which is beneficial for everyone, and Iran can also help this process with its potential.
V. Davtyan: What? expectations has Tehran of Armenia towards current complicated escalation conditions. yours according to, what kind political and strategic position need is will adopt Yerevan:
Ambassador.- We consider Armenia our friend and brother country. In this war situation, we have seen the support of the government and people of Armenia, for which we are extremely grateful.
Naturally, when Iran’s national sovereignty and territorial integrity are subjected to illegal and brutal attacks, we expect them to condemn it. This responsibility is not only on Armenia, but it is the responsibility of the whole world and the international community. Because if the “laws of the jungle” spread by Trump begin to rule, no country will be safe and free from the negative consequences of lawlessness and disorder.
This is the friendly expectation that we had and have from all our friends. We have good relations with Armenia, and the Armenian government has provided us with important assistance in some humanitarian issues, such as the issues arising from the cancellation of flights, for which we are grateful.
At the same time, in this war situation, we want and expect the following from the Armenian government: when some hostile elements and a limited number of people who consider themselves Iranian, but in the conditions where their country has been subjected to terrible aggression and their countrymen are killed, but these people express their joy and support the policies of Trump and the actions of American soldiers, often even praising the American soldier who attacked Iran, it is our expectation that serious steps will be taken against them and they will not be allowed to engage in such actions. This is our serious expectation from our friendly state of Armenia.
V. Davtyan:- During our private conversation, you said that Iran’s victory is inevitable. What do you mean by victory? Խնդրում եմ նաև մանրամասնել՝ այդ պարագայում ինչպե՞ս եք տեսնում Հարավային Կովկասում ուժերի դասավորությունն ու անվտանգության ճարտարապետությունը։ Ի՞նչ ռազմավարական կամ քաղաքական փոխակերպումների պետք է ենթարկվի տարածաշրջանը հետկոնֆլիկտային փուլում։ Միաժամանակ, ինչպիսի՞ փոխակերպումներ կարող են ունենալ հայ-իրանական հարաբերությունները:
Ambassador:– Ինչ վերաբերում է վերջին հարցին, ապա պետք է նշել, որ հաղթանակը հարաբերական հասկացություն է։ Եթե հաշվի առնենք Միացյալ Նահանգների և սիոնիստական ռեժիմի հետապնդած նպատակներն Իրանի վրա հարձակման ժամանակ, ապա արդեն հիմա կարելի է ասել, որ Իրանը հաղթել է՝ առանց որևէ կասկածի։ This is not just my personal opinion. ես կարող եմ ձեզ ներկայացնել ամերիկացի բազմաթիվ փորձագետների և վերլուծաբանների տեսակետներ, որոնք կրկնում են նույն միտքը։
The fact is that the United States and the Zionist regime did not achieve their goals, which were the collapse of Iran, the occupation of the country, the change of the political system, as well as the creation of chaos and the fragmentation of the country. All these were part of their plans, and failure to achieve them means defeat in itself. Iran is standing firm, retaliating and defending itself. It responds to the attacks, caused significant damage to the American military bases in the region, and also caused great damage to various Israeli infrastructures.
At the same time, it should be noted that Iran acts almost alone. You know that we are virtually alone in the war against the enemy, and during this national defense, no country participates and supports us by our side and on our behalf. Meanwhile, the United States possesses the most powerful military force in human history, and the Israeli regime is a completely militarized system, equipped largely with state-of-the-art weaponry provided by the Americans or from its own arsenal.
Therefore, if we take these conditions and the situation into account, it will become clear that even under these conditions, Iran, as a lone warring country, which fights solely based on its own capabilities, can already be considered a winner. The enemy has not achieved his goals, and the costs for our opponents are increasing day by day and will continue to increase. We are fully determined that Iran will not come out of this war as the defeated side.
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