ITALIAN RESEARCHER: ARMENIAN AND AZERBAIJANI MIGRANTS IN TURKEY BOTH WANT TO MAKE MONEY
Anna Muradyan
09:42, February 23, 2015
Hetq talks to Italian sociologist Fabio Salomoni, a faculty member
at Koc University’s Social Sciences and Humanities, who began to take
an interest in Turkey in the 1990s.
Salomoni has also focused on the plight of Armenian and Azerbaijan
migrants in Turkey and his latest paper on the issue is entitled
“Just Beyond the Border: Azerbaijani and Armenian Migrants in Turkey.”
Referring to the southern Caucasus, Salomoni argues that the only
reason the world is interested in the area was the Karabakh War,
despite the fact that some one million migrants left Armenia during
those years and probably an equal number from Azerbaijan.
What are the differences, if any, between Armenian and Azerbaijan
migrants residing in Turkey?
One difference is that the bulk of Armenians are located in Istanbul,
whereas Azerbaijanis are scattered throughout the country. Of course,
there are Armenians in Antalya, Izmir and Ankara, but very few. On
the other hand, while there are many Azerbaijanis in Istanbul, there
are also many in Izmir and especially Igdir and Kars.
It’s difficult to compare these two communities. Sometimes they
express this difference in the most unexpected manner. Yes, one can
say that Armenia and Turkey are enemies and that Armenians should
have big issues with Turkey, but sometimes the opposite occurs.
Armenian migrants have the same issues with Turkish employers as any
other migrant group.
Azerbaijanis shouldn’t have problems in Turkey, but if you ask an
average Turk about their opinion regarding Azerbaijanis the only
thing they know is that they speak a laughable and strange sort of
Turkish and that their accent is different.
But there is also a sub-context to the ridicule – of communism, soviets
and atheism. Sure the Azerbaijanis are Muslims, but not real Muslims,
because they do not think about religion much.
Perhaps the biggest difference is in regards to expectations. When
Azerbaijanis come to Turkey, they believe that they are going to
see their brothers and will work besides them. But this isn’t how it
works out. They are still migrants. That myth about brotherhood is
pure rhetoric.
What relations exist, if any, between Armenian and Azerbaijani
migrants?
There are places where both sides come into contact; whether they
like to or not. Take the police station for example. Since most are
illegal migrants, that’s where they end up if detained. They are also
side by side when working as street vendors.
As to how they communicate with one another mainly depends on their
age. The older ones have a history of living together and thus they get
along better. The younger ones do not mingle because they lack such a
history. It’s much harder for them to compose a positive picture of
the other. Nevertheless, there are times when they must get along;
say when they work in a factory together.
But ultimately, the one trait they share is that they have come to
Turkey to make money. This main issue pushes the national context
aside. Both communities understand that it’s best if they avoid
confrontation.
Of course, if certain Azerbaijani have links to nationalist Turkish
groups they may display greater aggression towards Armenians but,
in the main, that’s not the case.
How do these two communities feel in Turkey?
First, I’d like to stress that while most Armenians from Armenia in
Turkey are women, there are also many young people and seniors; also
children. The Azerbaijani community is more balanced in terms of sex.
Many Azerbaijanis are disillusioned because the majority of them want
settle in Turkey. They see Turkey as a country where they can receive
easy citizenship. But that’s not the case, even for them.
Most Armenians, on the other hand, do not plan to live the rest of
their lives in Turkey. They cannot picture themselves as part of
Turkish society. However, there are many Armenian migrants who have
lived there for ten or more years.
In reality, in a way, it is easier for Armenians because most migrants
work as house cleaners. Such jobs are regarded as good and easy.
That’s to say such work isn’t the worst kind to find. The men, in
the main, work in factories where the pay is less and the work harder.
Have you tried to ascertain how many Armenian migrants there are
in Istanbul?
It’s an impossible task because statistics on migrants in Turkey aren’t
kept. However, I was once told by the Azerbaijani embassy that some
50,000 Azerbaijani migrants were in Turkey. They are five times more
Azerbaijanis than Armenians.
Is the number of Armenian migrants growing or getting smaller?
I have the feeling that the flow of migrants from Armenia has decreased
over the past three years. The same holds true for Armenians going
to Turkey on business.
What’s the reason?
Large numbers of Armenians came to Istanbul in the late 1990s. Even
though Russia at the time was the most attractive for Armenian migrants
overall, Turkey was more attractive for middle aged Armenian women
who couldn’t overcome the economic problems facing them in Armenia
after independence. They had to make a living somehow and the most
immediate solution was in Turkey. It was inexpensive and nearby,
and there were jobs for women.
Azerbaijanis started coming to Turkey in the late 1980s, a decade or
so before the Armenians.
Around two years ago, Turkey adopted a new law regarding visas and
residency status. How has it affected the Armenian migrant community?
I believe it made things tougher for illegal migrants. Prior to the
new law, they could enter Turkey with a three month tourist visa,
leave the country, and then receive another three month visa. The
new law stipulates they can only stay in Turkey for six months in a
one year period. It’s limited their mobility and forces them to apply
for legal residency status.
Illegal migrants have no rights in Turkey when something happens to
them and they have issues to resolve. However, if these people are
in Turkey, it would appear that the country has a need of them and
must come to grips with their existence. What is Turkey doing in
this direction?
For a long time, Turkey was a labor exporter. During the past ten
years, it has witnessed a return of migrants and has become a final
destination country. In reality, people come to Turkey for work. This
is something new for the country and is forcing Turkey to change. This
is a big challenge. This law was the first step in the process.
There’s an idea that it would be good to create a resource center
in Kumkapi or another place with many Armenians for the Armenian
migrants; a center where they could go to get assistance legally. What
do you think?
In the past 3-5 years, a number of organizations have started to get
involved in migration issues. When I first arrived in Turkey no one
was interested in the plight of migrants. Such assistance centers are
needed not only for Armenians but for all migrants since they share
the same issues.
For example, migrants from Armenia have been able to get a school for
their kids opened. Other migrant groups still don’t have such a school.
Many Azerbaijani migrants pay to send their children to local Turkish
schools. But not all can afford to do so. Turkey must think of ways
to solve the education issue of migrant children.
However, no one in the education system is focusing attention on where
migrant children must go to school or for medical help. Sometimes,
Armenian migrants can go to Armenian community hospitals.
If you go to Europe, you’ll see that the migration issue is a top
concern in all respects. But at the moment, in Turkey, there hasn’t
been any political solution to the problem. It’s all left to the
communities to handle in their own way.
If one cannot enter the Turkish education system, the migrant community
then builds its own school, just like the Armenians have done. Who
knows how long this approach will last.
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