on 168TV’s “Classes” program Satik Seyranyan the guest Aram Orbelyan, manager-partner of “Concern Dialog” law office, specialist in international law, lawyer is.

The main theses of the interview are below.

• Gagik Tsarukyan’s case is not the first. there were cases when a person was taken out of the Investigative Committee, they laid him on the ground, made a video, and brought him back in again… They said, “Can we go out for a moment, take a picture, then go back in, and continue… Remember the case of Kochubaev?” There are other cases.

• Armenia is part of the European legal and political system. From this whole concept we took only the police. If the handcuff did not fit on Gagik Tsarukyan’s arm, why was it necessary to use it at all? Why was disproportionate force necessary?

• The head of the government says: I gave an assignment. And who are you to give an assignment? To whom was it given, when was it given the assignment, and why was the assignment fulfilled now?:

• We are the first solver of our problems. Today’s non-talking of the international structure will cause a problem for them tomorrow. At this moment, Armenia is changing from an independent state to a neo-colonial regime.

• Unfortunately, normalization is coming to us now. We say they will get caught, when it shouldn’t be like that. Those judges who say, “Well, what would we do” are committing a crime. What should you do? Just do your professional job within the law and within your authority. It makes no difference whether you deprive a person of an illegal life or of freedom: Well, you judge me, take out the gun at once, shoot, escape… 

As soon as imprisonment and political murders no longer help this government, it will be the turn of forced disappearances of people… There are examples of this in international practice. We are crawling towards that process:

• The lion is the most emotional part of this whole story. It evokes emotions so that for people it is like watching a soap opera. For example, when Azerbaijan’s Foreign Minister Bayramov talks about “enclaves” these days, it does not cause emotion, it causes the death of a lion.

• When 70 companies related to Gagik Tsarukyan are investigated at the same time, Europeans get the impression that they are dealing with the mafia.:

• When we look at the cases of Armen Ashotyan and other political prisoners, they are incomprehensible accusations. Legal protection should work for everyone. According to the CE report, more than 10,000 people in Armenia are under surveillance under one or another restraining order.

• If there is no production of phones in Armenia, why should we pay VAT or customs duty for imported phones? Don’t control, don’t stick your nose in, remove the toll. If I bring myself 10 computers, I’m doing well, if I change my phone every 3 months, I’m still doing well. But who said there has to be VAT on imported phones?:

• We’re not saying don’t solve crimes, we’re saying don’t eavesdrop on citizens. During these elections, the government widely eavesdropped on the representatives of the opposition forces and used it against them.

• NSS is a structure subordinate to the Prime Minister. Andranik Simonyan is Nikol Pashinyan’s direct subordinate. Regarding the video leaked by the National Security Service, they say that it is their video, they will do what they want, they will give it to whom they want. This means that the NSS gives everything to Nikol Pashinyan first:

• Political forces can generate the streets, use the tools of non-violent civil disobedience. But only political forces can decide that. I can only talk about legal and political tools. A number of parliamentary and human rights processes may take place.

• Look at the work of the Sacred Movement. From the beginning, there were no materials in the case of Saint Bagrat. Prosecutors filed charges. Now that the prosecutor is getting promoted, his friends should not salute him. The Shame Institute must work:

• They should pray, dream, light a candle for criminal proceedings against them, come, arrest, judge, sit, because history shows that dictatorships end with self-judgment of the people. There are many examples of this in history: Mussolini, Ceausescu, Saddam Hussein, Gaddafi, leaders of the Balkan countries:

• The head of the government gives the name of a specific judge and says that he is a briber. This is a crime. It is the responsibility of the Prosecutor General, the investigator, to initiate criminal proceedings and investigate them:

• We had a historic chance in the elections, which was stolen from us by the CEC, CC, 2 judges of the administrative court. They stole the parliamentary future of Armenia. More than 4% of voters said they want PAP to be in the Parliament. Those votes were stolen. We had a chance to have a Parliament, where the current government would have to negotiate with the opposition and choose a person with a certain degree of independence when electing the chief prosecutor and judge.:

• Now CP has exactly 3/5 and no more votes. In this situation, each CP deputy has the right of veto. Now, in order to appoint someone, the CP must have the presence and vote in favor of all its deputies.

• After the Erdogan putsch, journalists were arrested in Turkey and accused of writing articles that caused people’s dissatisfaction with the current government, and they stood up to protest.

• The parliamentary mandates of the National Assembly must be taken unequivocally. I don’t know in history when the failure to take mandates after the elections has led to a political crisis that somehow resolved itself. When people say don’t take the mandates, they should also say don’t take them, what should they do? 

• If I only said that the votes of “Prosperous Armenia” were stolen and did nothing, if I came here and said that they were stolen, what would people say to me? Many people watched the sessions of the Constitutional Court under the open procedure. Everyone saw that there was vote theft. Everyone saw what the CEC said, how it answered questions. Everyone saw that yes, there was a theft:

• We, as the representatives of “Prosperous Armenia” in the Constitutional Court, said: 9 judges should examine the case, return both of them, the CC cannot examine anything less than that. The CC said no. Our colleagues also said that those 2 cannot participate because they were members of the party, Seda Safaryan was also a candidate for deputy on the party’s list, remove him too… They did not remove him, and Seda Safaryan started asking questions in CP speech during the session. And everyone saw this.

• The CC once again recorded that Nikol is a liar, because there were no mass cases of voter bribery that would affect the course of the elections, the CC recorded that there was abuse of administrative resources and social programs, that there was one-sided propaganda in favor of the CP, the CC said many more things, but made a decision in favor of the CP. What the CC has done is a political process that will have legal consequences.

• Nikol should be constantly reminded that you stole the votes of PAP, do not speak on behalf of the people because you are in the Parliament with stolen votes.

• Writing something illegal in the pre-election program does not mean that it must be done. The issue of changing the Catholicos cannot be solved by the people, nor, even more so, by the CP. In the case of a 1700-year-old structure, it is clear. 

• CP, which received 3/5 as a result of stolen votes, does not have 2/3, therefore, it cannot change the Constitution. All other options to change the constitution are illegal:

• Parliamentary government works more stably, provides longer development than other ways of government. Now people will say that Coward wrote this Constitution, that’s why I say so, but there are empirical data to prove it. Parliamentarianism also allows for broad action in Parliament.

• At the beginning of the election campaign, Gagik Tsarukyan did not strongly criticize Nikol Pashinyan, but emphasized the importance of public solidarity and carried out his campaign. At some point, Pashinyan realized that this cannot continue, there is a danger, and he started using aggressive rhetoric.

• We should try to bring the point of establishment of the Armenian state closer, to return the Armenian state instead of a global, faceless, country simply named Armenia. We should not sit quietly, we should act, support all patriotic movements. The prosperity of our country will begin when our basic values ​​and universal values ​​are complete.

• Everyone’s responsibility should be nominal. It is a mistake to blame everything on the head alone. The reaction to the one who steals the future of your country should be adequate. It is more problematic that there are judges who do not wait for SMS, do not write to them, because they know what is required of them and do it.:

Details in the video.

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